All Quiet On The Eastern Front?

The coaching carousel is rotating but like DailyDoc said yesterday there are just not a lot of horses in the rotation. The same yesterday morning Kansas and Notre Dame were the only BCS jobs remaining but as soon as the sun was setting on the east Brian Kelly of Cincinnati was jockeying to Notre Dame. This may sound like good news to East Carolina fans given Skip Holtz’s connection to South Bend but that still means there are two BCS jobs remaining and Cincinnati and Kansas may have their eyes setting on the Pirate prospect.

Should I stay or should I go?
Should I stay or should I go?

Skip Holtz says he hasn’t spoken with any other schools about coaching jobs but that was almost a week ago. Yesterday I wasn’t aware of any noise but today, “Google Alert Created” and I’m afraid I know how this story ends. It goes something like this:

Skip arrives off the road to the eastern front with his friends Terry Holland, Todd Fitch and Greg Hudson. There they engage in frequent battles and endure the dangerous and often lifeless conditions of C-USA road battles. While fighting, winning and taking his comrades to bigger battles, he could only take them as far as the road to liberty would allow. After another victorious seasonal war he meets Lew Perkins; or is it Mike Thomas? I guess we’ll have to wait for the road back.

Anybody have a better ending?

Update: According to rivals.com Cinci has asked for permission to talk to Houston coach Kevin Sumlin.

Update #2[Brian]: There is some chatter on Twitter that Kansas is very interested in Skip Holtz. The AD at Kansas is Lew Perkins who hired Holtz at UConn in 1994.

Update #3  Holtz addresses rumors   “When there is something to report, I’ll be the first to report it”

Update #4  Reported –  Buffalo coach Turner Gill to coach at Kansas.

Update#5  Houston coach says no to Cincinnati.  Non-BCS says no to BCS?? That’s got to be B C S…

Update#6  Hotlz a top candidate for Cincy  “Athletic Director Mike Thomas is hoping to name a new head coach before the Sugar Bowl on Jan. 1″

30 thoughts on “All Quiet On The Eastern Front?”

  1. If you want I’ll talk to Terry. My wife grew up in Charlottesville and babysat his kids when he coached Virginia. We trade Xmas cards.

  2. The Buffalo News is reporting that Kansas asked permission to speak with Buffalo coach Turner Gill the day after former coach Mark Mangino was forced to resign.

    The Kansas City Star reported Friday that Jones has already spoken to Kansas athletic director Lew Perkins about the Jayhawks’ head coaching job. The paper said Stanford coach Jim Harbaugh is Kansas’ top choice, with East Carolina coach Skip Holtz, son of former Notre Dame coach Lou Holtz, and Buffalo coach Turner Gill also serious candidates.

  3. ^Mike, exactly.

    And I’ll give you one better. Is Kansas a better job than ECU? Certainly debatable.

    FWIW, my sources tell me that ECU coaches do not expect to be in Greenville next season, but I take that knowing I did not hear it with mine own ears.

    So it begs the question I raised in the other post: Why is ol’ Skip not at the top of more people’s lists? After back-to-back C-USA titles, Cincy wants to talk to Houston’s coach, who ECU beat for the title? Skip appears to A name in a lot of circles, but not THE name.

  4. ^Doesn’t that make him a little like Herb Sendek? People talk about how great he is yet no one really puts their money where their mouth is.

  5. I think ECU to Kansas is a lateral move at best.

    If coaches are saying they don’t expect to be in Greenville that means either Cincy or Kansas is keeping their dealings mighty quiet. It’s really too quiet. I thought for sure Terry Holland would have been contacted for permission to talk to Holtz by now. There are a few ambiguities in the situation; smoke and mirrors….. Then again maybe all is quiet on the eastern front…..for now…

  6. I’d say Kansas is a step up but only because it is in the Big 12. And they have basketball, whereas ECU does not.

    I’ll beat you to it: State doesn’t have football or basketball….

  7. A BCS job is an upgrade over a non-BCS job.

    Kansas’ side of the Big 12 is not what you’d call a “murderer’s row”. It’s not like taking the Baylor job and looking up at Texas, Oklahoma, Texas Tech and OK State.

  8. Yeah but we’re talking about a football coach going to a basketball school and Holtz who may have ties to the AD has no ties to the recruiting base out there. Being in the Big 12 is the only plus but I just don’t see how you win football games with Kansas. I realize they won 12 games a few years ago but that was under Mark Mangino who resigned got fired.

  9. Butch Davis came to Carolina, and he’s a much bigger name than Skip Holtz.

    Plus, he’d likely be able to forge recruiting ties there, while at the same time maintaining his ties in this area. That could be part of what would make him attractive to Kansas.

    I don’t know that he will or won’t go, but having the prior connections with the AD can’t hurt his chances.

    He said on the Packman show last week that he doesn’t have an agent, so unless his dad or someone is speaking on his behalf he shouldn’t have had any contact with Kansas yet about the job.

  10. That bigger name is 1-1 against Skip and 1-3 against ECU.

    I got no problems with Skip leaving. He’s been great for ECU and I can’t blame him if he decides to move on to a BCS school. Any reasonable Pirate fan will tell you the same. What’s frustrating is the mere fact that there is such a thing as the BCS and ECU in on the outside looking in. That’s what makes this whole thing feel shitty. It will sting a little bit more if he goes to Kansas; Notre Dame I completely understand but Kansas? I think that will leave a bad taste in Pirate fan’s mouth.

  11. Dan,

    “A BCS job is an upgrade over a non-BCS job.”

    Baylor, Iowa State, and Indiana are BCS jobs. I don’t know if they are upgrades over Boise State, BYU, or even ECU. On the other hand, sometimes that jump just doesn’t work out from the coaching standpoint. Ask Dan Hawkins if he wishes he was still at Boise.

    J,

    Kansas was what I heard as well. Again, I don’t know about these guys who jump from non-BCS to some of these flash-in-the-pan successful BCS schools. Wonder if Steve Kragthorpe would do the same thing all over again?

  12. If Kansas is Holtz’s “special situation”, Terry Holland should consider keeping Defensive Coordinator Greg Hudson for Holtz replacement. After all it has been ECU’s defense that has carried this team.

    That, or keep Hudson as D coordinator and bring Steve Logan back as HC. That would an incredible duo for ECU.

  13. If a coach wants to prove himself, stepping up into a BCS conference is the way to do it. Boise State is always going to have to answer for its weak conference schedule, just like any other non-BCS school has to do if they have a really good season.

    Basically, the coaches have egos. Most of them want to succeed at the highest levels, rather than settling for being the big fish in a little pond. Not to mention that BCS jobs tend to pay significantly more money. Kragthorpe crashed and burned at Louisville, but will still probably make more money from Louisville the next two seasons than he would if he’d stayed at Tulsa.

    Based on rumors, Kansas is going after Harbaugh from Stanford. Holtz and Turner Gill are both apparently willing to take the job, but aren’t the top choice.

  14. The University of Kansas will reportedly name Buffalo head coach Turner Gill the next top man of the Jayhawks’ football

  15. STANFORD, Calif. — Jim Harbaugh wants to put an end to rumors linking him to other jobs, saying he will remain Stanford’s football coach.

    -AP

  16. Actually, the rumor that I read (which is why I said “Based on rumors”) said that Gill and Holtz were both willing to take the job. I believe it was on SI.com. I didn’t make it up.

    I’m not sad that he’s staying and I wouldn’t have been happy if he had left. I really don’t care.

    No matter what, ECU is always a team I expect NCSU to beat.

    I suspect they chose Gill because he has more connections to that part of the country. It’s interesting that they hired a guy whose team just finished 5-7 instead of the coach of the back-to-back CUSA champions.

    It’s also interesting that you took the time to HTML “your” in bold, only to follow it up with a misspelled “presumption”. I don’t mean to get all “grammar police”…I just think it’s funny.

  17. I find it interesting its obviously you do care. You own half the comments on a thread about on the very subject. Believe you me, NC State is always a team I and many State fans I know expect ECU to beat. Any bottom feeding all O no D ACC team would fit right in with a “non-BCS” C-USA West team. Welcome to the party pal…
    Do you find it interesting I’m not going to bother with correcting presumption? I really don’t care.

  18. 4 out of 21. Now, I suppose 5 of 22.

    I have family that went to ECU. I have family at ECU now. I have family that follows ECU football. I have an interest in what happens there.

    In this particular thread, I was really just having a conversation about why a coach at a non-BCS school would consider Kansas. I didn’t say I thought Skip would, could or should take the job.

    As for what you “expect” when ECU plays NCSU….you guys lost to a team quarterbacked by Daniel Evans. At home, no less.

  19. JHC dan, you are one hair spliting persistent SOB. If you have family that went to ECU and have family at ECU and they follow ECU football then you CARE.

    …Certainly less than beating a team quarterbacked by Pat White and Case Keenum.

  20. Caring, as it pertains to Holtz, means I care whether he stays or goes. I don’t. I couldn’t care less if Holtz coaches ECU, Kansas, Buffalo, JH Rose, or the Washington Pam Pack next season.

    Having an interest in whether he stays or goes is a different thing. I talk ECU sports when I’m around those people, so if they were replacing a coach it would be a big deal.

    In this particular thread, my main points have been about the fact that there is a pecking order in Div-1 football. BCS > non-BCS. Some people think that there are non-BCS jobs worth staying at over a BCS opportunity….I disagree. That doesn’t mean I’m right, and it doesn’t mean that some coaches won’t turn down BCS offers to stay at a non-BCS school.

    The only Holtz-related things I posted were rumors and speculation, other than the post where I said that Holtz told Packman he doesn’t have an agent. Someone asked why Holtz would go to a “basketball school”, so I pointed out that Butch Davis went to UNC. That just means that it happens….regardless of record, Butch is a bigger name than Skip and he did it.

    You played Pat White when a new head coach was trying to make him a passing QB. Keenum is a system guy who plays in a joke conference. Daniel Evans was a mostly useless ACC QB and he beat ECU.

  21. Keep splitting dan, Nobody is arguing that non-BCS > BCS but obviously Houston head football coach Kevin Sumlin thinks a non-BCS job is worth staying at over a BCS opportunity. Skip Holtz chose ECU over Syracuse last year and I think both college football coaches know a little bit more about worth and opportunity than dan of NC. But keep making excuses for ECU’s and other non-BCS school’s success. Keep hanging your hat on that BCS rack b/c right now that seems to be all State fan has in arguing pecking order with ECU despite the Pirates’ last two losses to NCSU.

  22. Big J, to hear State fan tell it NXSU is the best team in the state because of their recent record of wins over UNX and EXU. Damn the fact that both schools have finished with better records for the last 2 years and that EXU is now 2 time CUSA champs. All that matters is head-to-head, don’t you know that?

  23. If you can’t see a difference between interest in whether he stays or goes and concern over whether he stays or goes, that’s your problem, not mine.

    NC State beat Pitt and UNC this season. Pick your two best ECU wins, and those two are better. Then, there are the two straight wins over ECU. Lastly, there is ECU chickening out of this year’s game against NCSU.

    I am not making excuses for ECU’s success. I was pulling for them against Houston. I was pulling for App State yesterday. I don’t begrudge ECU any successes they may have, unless it is in a game against NCSU. I just think that ECU fans need to understand that they don’t play against a lot of tough teams in CUSA…that’s just fact.

    I can’t say anything to UNC fan other than “scoreboard” over State’s win, because UNC plays in the same conference against similar OOC team and has a much better record. ECU doesn’t. The only CUSA team that was over .500 OOC was Houston. Every other school was .500 or worse, and then they just beat up on each other in-conference.

    Skip can afford to wait for a good job. I think that’s why he turned down Syracuse. He didn’t need to take a job in freaking Syracuse without getting huge money. ECU is a good job, he makes good money, he obviously isn’t going to jump at the first train out of town. Same with Sumlin, except Sumlin has only been a head coach for two years. He may just want to get a little more experience before jumping up a level. Especially to go to a school where the previous coach just went undefeated….that’s a pretty large pair of shoes to fill.

    Most likely, Skip came back to ECU hoping to go 10-2 or 11-1 and make himself a candidate at Notre Dame. That didn’t happen, so he probably now realized his next step won’t be Notre Dame. That means he’s more likely to leave, which is probably why he talked with Kansas. The way it is being reported, he didn’t turn KU down…they just selected Gill instead of him.

    It is fairly apparent that Skip is leaving. He has been in talks with other schools now for two years straight. This thread was a discussion of why a coach like Skip would leave ECU for a place like Kansas. There are very good reasons to go, and there are very good reasons to stay.

    There is a ceiling at a non-BCS school. I don’t believe that most coaches are content to coach under that ceiling for too long. TCU and Boise State went undefeated this season, and get to play in the 3rd place bowl. If Kansas had gone undefeated, they’d likely be playing Alabama for the national championship.

  24. I see your act clearly.

    Only a fan of a team who was a bottom feeder this year points out 2 of their total 3 wins; I’m not counting Murry Prison camp and Garner High. Either way ECU’s 9-4 is better than State’s 3-7 period. I don’t care if one of State’s wins was over Alabama. And right, ECU chicking out on State? WTF-ever. Terry Holland and our OOCS year after year says we aint scared.

    I find it hard to believe you pull for ECU at any point as much as you try to discredit us. ECU fans completely understand what C-USA teams bring to the table but State fan needs to understand teams like ECU, Houston, Tulsa, Southern Miss and UCF are tough and would give any ACC or BCS team a run for it’s money, especially the likes of NCSU, Duke, UVA and MD.

    It will always seem apparent a successful non-BCS coach is leaving so long as there is a BCS. Any good coach is going to be on a list of potential candidates, year after year. I only hope for ECU’s sake and college football’s sake that one day these imperialistic chains be broken.

  25. I picked two wins because after that, the teams that we lost to probably are probably better than the teams ECU beat.

    TH and your OOCS can say whatever you want, but the fact is that a scheduled game was moved because of ECU’s request. That makes your trash-talk about two 1-AA teams irrelevant.

    Plus, ECU would only be 8-4 if we aren’t counting 1-AA teams.

    ECU had a better season than NCSU. I don’t think I’ve argued that point a single time. So did UNC, Duke, and a bunch of other teams.

    You said ECU to Kansas was lateral, at best. I disagreed, and you took it as a slight by me against ECU. That isn’t what it was or how I meant it. I posted a rumor from SI.com that Gill and Holtz were both ready to accept the job if offered, and you took it as me pushing Holtz out of Pitt County. In reality, all I was doing was sharing something I saw that I thought fit in this thread.

    You are really overly sensitive about this stuff. Just because I have a different opinion than you about the pecking order of these jobs doesn’t mean I have this big anti-ECU agenda you keep trying to pin on me. It’s just not there.

    In my first post, I didn’t mention ECU or SH at all. I gave my opinion on BCS vs. non-BCS, and explained that Kansas is in the much easier half of a power conference…two things that would make KU attractive to ANY coaching candidate, not just the one in Greenville.

    In my 2nd, I simply responded to someone who wondered why Holtz would go to a basketball school. Then, I mentioned the AD connection to Holtz through UConn and something I heard him say on the Packman show.

    In my 3rd, no mention of ECU or Holtz until posting the rumor from SI.com about him and Gill. No opinion about Holtz staying or going at all. Simply more general reasons for my opinion that a BCS job is better than a non-BCS one.

    In my 4th post, I had to answer accusations from you that I dreamed up Skip’s willingness to take the KU job. By this point I was tired of you accusing me of taking shots at ECU when I hadn’t, so I sort of took one. Even though saying that ECU is a team I expect to beat isn’t really a “shot” at ECU.

    Since that post, mine have basically been more explanations of why you are SO off base in saying that I have an ax to grind with ECU. I simply don’t.

    However, I do think that any trash talking you do should be tempered by the fact that ECU plays in a weaker conference. That doesn’t mean (and never will) that State’s 5-7 is better than ECU’s 9-4, but at the same time since ECU lost all three games they played against BCS teams there is no reason to think they would have been all that great in the ACC.

    The average Sagarin ranking of NCSU’s conference opponents is 47.125. The average Sagarin ranking of ECU’s conference opponents is 90. That’s including the championship game. Without that, it’s 95.5. Houston is ranked 46th, and is the highest ranked CUSA team. They are only 1.125 behind State’s average. There 8 CUSA teams behind Duke, and 4 behind Maryland.

    At 51, ECU is only 21 spots ahead of a horrible State team. There are 7 ACC teams rated ahead of the Pirates.

    When I talk trash about CUSA, it isn’t out of spite for ECU. It’s because it’s true.

    Either way, a quick scan of the posts in this thread will show that I didn’t initiate any trashing of any school. The only possible way you could even think I did would be if you took issue with my statement that Butch is a much bigger name than Skip, but I don’t think very many people would argue that point.

  26. Dan, I’ve known you long enough to know what’s a slight from you so your history proves otherwise. You can rationalize it all you want and if anyone else is reading this which at this point I doubt they can judge for themselves. I think the only thing we will ever agree on is that we disagree and if you can’t see that my talk is tempered by ECU’s weaker conference than you’re not reading carefully enough.

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